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Karl Shapiro: Selected Poems (American Poets Project)

I’ve always loved these covers. Brilliant. Chip Kidd and Mark Melnick did these.

The lowercase futura bold for the editors name bothers me a bit, but I could very comfortably live with it for a hundred years.

— ian b. shimkoviak , 2008-11-03 10:02:00 -0500

I think this is my favourite one of the series, I much prefer it when the letters in the background are more abstract and almost un-distinguishable. I also kind of wish that the text box was in a fixed position from cover to cover.

— , 2008-11-03 11:28:00 -0500

Very nice… slick and tightly composed. The red and white stripes conveys just enough and not too much of the “American” – it works in an abstract sort of way. I enjoy that brownish-maroon hue going on back there.

I am confused why this would require two folks at the design table,though. Can someone explain to this layman the use of a designer and an art director? Particularly in conjunction with this.

— C-Dog , 2008-11-03 12:19:00 -0500

Perhaps because it’s a series?

— C-Dog , 2008-11-03 12:20:00 -0500

I assume that Chip hired Mark, who is a freelance designer. Hence the Art Director/Designer relationship.

— , 2008-11-03 13:23:00 -0500

I quite like this although I do agree with Ian that the editor’s name almost pops more than the poet’s name … I think the type there could use some finessing.

— Auguste , 2008-11-03 14:54:00 -0500

It’s funny, I see that there seems to be a letter used from the title and editors name. They are set in both a sans and serif face to create the object. They always seem to touch the horizontal bar with the series title, in an almost uncomfortable way. It’s all very pleasing. I wonder what the decision process on something like this looked like… Who came up with what etc. It must be very pleasurable to work with that kind of push and pull, give and take—and then BAM! you have a great little series for some really nice books.

— ian b. shimkoviak , 2008-11-03 14:56:00 -0500

Hi all,

Chip indeed hired me for this … He provided the initial art direction (in a nutshell, “It can’t look like every other poetry series out there”), I went off and designed a set of comps, Chip killed those comps, I went off and re-designed it, he loved the second attempt, and that’s what you see here.

I fully agree that some of these work really well, others less so, and some don’t work at all (Edna St. Vincent Millay is downright embarrassing, though it’s the best-selling volume in the series, so go figure). In my defense, I had only been designing covers for two years when I did this, so there are a lot of things I would do differently today.

And, amazingly, the publisher gave me the chance a few months ago; they’re getting ready to launch the redesigned series very soon.

— Mark Melnick , 2008-11-03 22:30:00 -0500

I’m sorry, but I think it’s pretty awful. The type is just completely wrong (Clarendon and futura don’t fit together), the white shape seems completely arbitrary to me, and as a whole the design is out of balance: it looks like gravity has pulled everything to the bottom of the page…

— , 2008-11-03 23:11:00 -0500

For the record, it’s Monotype Ionic and Twentieth Century … I was going for a period feel, 1930s/40s WPA. Sure, the type might be somewhat awkward (again, I was pretty new to this), but if you look at the work of Herbert Spencer, Max Bill, or Bradbury Thompson – all active during that time – you’ll see this very combination quite frequently.

As for the sense of gravity, that’s intentional. My idea was to create a sort of sculpture out of two initials (one from the poet, one from the editor), and situating the unit on a foundation at the bottom of the page seemed to emphasize this sculptural notion.

I fully agree this particular cover isn’t overly successful, but that’s what happens when you’re designing a series with fairly fixed rules: sometimes, the letters I had to use didn’t combine well, and there were many instances where I had to use the same letter combinations again and again (there are close to thirty volumes in the series). Needless to say, when redesigning the series, I loosened up the rules a bit.

— Mark Melnick , 2008-11-03 23:48:00 -0500

I like ‘em!

— dave , 2008-11-04 02:18:00 -0500

How did you manage to work with Kidd after two years in the business?

— , 2008-11-04 05:27:00 -0500

Proximity. I had just been hired at Vintage, which is down the hall from Knopf.

— Mark Melnick , 2008-11-04 06:24:00 -0500

I can see the difficulty behind designing a very large series when you limited yourself to such few elements and I do think that some of them are weaker then others but as a series I think they work well and I look forward to seeing the redesigned ones but I am curious as to why you decided to let the text box to move up and down?

also I like the mixmatched type very much, thanks

— , 2008-11-04 07:34:00 -0500

The text panel remained in the same position left-to-right, but to keep it in the same position top-to-bottom as well would have created an additional limitation that I didn’t think was necessary.

— Mark Melnick , 2008-11-04 07:57:00 -0500

To comment on Jeffrey’s statement. Awful is an awful strong word. These are all very unique and I think they are very successful as individual books and as a series.

— , 2008-11-04 08:13:00 -0500

thanks for the explanation mark, It’s not that I don’t like the moving text box I was just curious about the decision behind it. When I first saw your covers I thought of the early penguin poetry books with the fixed title box and I just interested to see that you had allowed it to move.

— , 2008-11-04 22:39:00 -0500

wow this is the best discussion in a while.

series are tough, but this is a cool idea!

— , 2008-11-05 01:46:00 -0500

Maybe awful indeed is strong, but I just really don’t like it, and don’t see what everyone else here is raving about. Kidd has done many brilliant covers, and it’s not that I don’t see the difficulty of creating a nice series. It just doesn’t work for me, that’s all. They look like a good idea that took a wrong turn somewhere….

— , 2008-11-05 03:20:00 -0500

They’re different from what you would expect and what is out there. I think that is what attracts me. I also think typographically they are interesting and playful, but serious enough as well.

Yeah, awful is harsh, but it’s not the first time something’s been trashed here…

— ian shimkoviak , 2008-11-05 04:20:00 -0500

This place is like the worst cover meeting Ive ever been in…. ... a nightmare… personally I enjoy this cover.

— , 2008-11-05 15:26:00 -0500

We aim to please.

And if all you say in your typical cover meeting is, “I enjoy this cover,” then I salute the incredibly liberal and un-analytical nature of your work environment.

My Freshman creative writing class had more group criticism in 10 minutes than this website has in 10 weeks. Gesh… lightweights.

— C-Dog , 2008-11-05 15:37:00 -0500

Why did you feel the need to list Chip Kidd as the Art Director?
I don’t recall you ever crediting an Art Director before – is it because it’s Chip Kidd?

— Amazon Kindle , 2008-11-06 00:47:00 -0500

kidd and melnick are credited in the books.

— ian b. shimkoviak , 2008-11-06 03:35:00 -0500

I submitted this cover series because as a writer but decidedly not a designer, I was stunned by how popular this cover design is—among visual artists but not writers. I have never met a poet who liked these covers. It seems to reflect a constipated idea of poetry. Compression and impenetrability? That’s arguable, but I don’t think the point of the covers was to make that argument.

I don’t dig it but I defer to your design brains and figure I’m missing something huge because I found the type treatment on the covers a turnoff. Love the backgrounds, though. And the stripe.

— , 2008-11-07 05:18:00 -0500

I wonder if it was popular amongst readers… if it’s undergoing a redesign and presumably a reprint, I would think it was well received…

— ian b. shimkoviak , 2008-11-07 05:57:00 -0500

I disagree with Jeffery. I think the typefaces work together—they are nice contrasts. I also question whether the editor’s names should be all lowercase, but I think it’s the colors and the abstract shape that are surprising and original.

— , 2008-11-20 13:45:00 -0500

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